In my previous posts on the continuity hypothesis . I took this to Greg [? An Exploration of Religion: An Interview with Brian Muraresku Plants of the Gods: Hallucinogens, Healing, Culture and Conservation And that is that there was a pervasive religion, ancient religion, that involved psychedelic sacraments, and that that pervasive religious culture filtered into the Greek mysteries and eventually into early Christianity. Video: Psychedelics: The Ancient Religion with No Name? And this is at a time when we're still hunting and gathering. Now, that date is obviously very suggestive because that's precisely the time the Christians were establishing a beachhead in Rome. So I think this was a minority of early Christians. And I wonder and I question how we can keep that and retain that for today. The Tim Ferriss Show - Transcripts PDF Thesis-The Religion of Constantine I - University Of Ottawa And I want to ask you about specifically the Eleusinian mysteries, centered around the goddesses Demeter and Persephone. So there's lots of interesting details here that filter through. I mean, if Burkert was happy to speculate about psychedelics, I'm not sure why Ruck got the reception that he did in 1978 with their book The Road to Eleusis. The Tim Ferriss Show | iHeart So I'm not convinced that-- I think you're absolutely right that what this establishes is that Christians in southern Italy could have-- could have had access to the kinds of things that have been recovered from that drug farm, let's call it. But so as not to babble on, I'll just say that it's possible that the world's first temple, which is what Gobekli Tepe is referred to as sometimes, it's possible the world's first temple was also the world's first bar. OK-- maybe one of those ancient beers. And what you're referring to is-- and how I begin the book is this beautiful Greek phrase, [SPEAKING GREEK]. It's arguably not the case in the third century. I've no doubt that Brian has unearthed and collected a remarkable body of evidence, but evidence of what, exactly? Then what was the Gospel of John, how did it interpret the Eucharist and market it, and so on. So Dionysus is not the god of alcohol. And keep in mind that we'll drop down into any one of these points more deeply. But even if they're telling the truth about this, even if it is accurate about Marcus that he used a love potion, a love potion isn't a Eucharist. And the big question for me was what was that something else? That is, by giving, by even floating the possibility of this kind of-- at times, what seems like a Dan Brown sort of story, like, oh my god, there's a whole history of Christianity that's been suppressed-- draws attention, but the real point is actually that you're not really certain about the story, but you're certain is that we need to be more attentive to this evidence and to assess it soberly. [2] I want to thank you for putting up with me and my questions. The Wanderer | Old English Poetry Project | Rutgers University The Immortality Key: The Secret History of the Religion with No Name That's our next event, and will be at least two more events to follow. Copyright 2023 The President and Fellows of Harvard College, The Immortality Key: The Secret History of the Religion with No Name. And so in the epilogue, I say we simply do not know the relationship between this site in Spain and Eleusis, nor do we know what was happening at-- it doesn't automatically mean that Eleusis was a psychedelic rite. If you are drawn to psychedelics, in my mind, it means you're probably drawn to contemplative mysticism. And for those of you who have found my line of questioning or just my general presence tedious, first of all, I fully appreciate that reaction. So I see-- you're moving back and forth between these two. Which is a very weird thing today. . But what we do know is that their sacrament was wine and we know a bit more about the wine of antiquity, ancient Greek wine, than we can piece together from these nocturnal celebrations. And I'll just list them out quickly. And anyone who drinks this, [SPEAKING GREEK], Jesus says in Greek, you remain in me and I in you. Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin: The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, Psychedelics, and More | Tim Ferriss Show #646 This notion in John 15:1, the notion of the true vine, for example, only occurs in John. What the Greeks were actually saying there is that it was barley infected with ergot, which is this natural fungus that infects cereal crops. And the reason I find that a worthy avenue of pursuit is because when you take a step back and look at the Greek of the Gospels, especially the Greek of John, which is super weird, what I see based on Dennis MacDonald's scholarship that you mentioned-- and others-- when you do the exegesis of John's gospel, there's just lots of vocabulary and lots of imagery that doesn't appear elsewhere. And so with a revised ancient history, in place Brian tacks back to the title of our series, Psychedelics and the Future of Religion. CHARLES STANG: Brian, I wonder if you could end by reflecting on the meaning of dying before you die. he goes out on a limb and says that black nightshade actually causes [NON-ENGLISH SPEECH], which is not unpleasant visions, i.e. So the Greek god of wine, intoxication. CHARLES STANG: All right. and he said, Brian, don't you dare. BRIAN MURARESKU: Now we're cooking with grease, Dr. Stang. That there is no hard archaeobotanical, archaeochemical data for spiked beer, spiked wine. One, on mainland Greece from the Mycenaean period, 16th century BC, and the other about 800 years later in modern day Turkey, another ritual potion that seemed to have suggested some kind of concoction of beer, wine, and mead that was used to usher the king into the afterlife. Let me start with the view-- the version of it that I think is less persuasive. And I think what the pharmaceutical industry can do is help to distribute this medicine. I mean, this is what I want to do with some of my remaining days on this planet, is take a look at all these different theories. Amazon.com: Customer reviews: The Immortality Key: The Secret History Like savory, wormwood, blue tansy, balm, senna, coriander, germander, mint, sage, and thyme. The Immortality Key Book Summary by Brian C. Muraresku BRIAN MURARESKU: But you're spot on. So when you take a step back, as you well know, there was a Hellenic presence all over the ancient Mediterranean. But the point being, if the Dionysian wine was psychedelic-- which I know is a big if-- I think the more important thing to show here in this pagan continuity hypothesis is that it's at least plausible that the earliest Christians would have at the very least read the Gospel of John and interpreted that paleo-Christian Eucharistic wine, in some communities, as a kind of Dionysian wine. Revolutionary Left Radio: Early Christianity: Psychedelics, Ancient And the one thing that unites both of those worlds in this research called the pagan continuity hypothesis, the one thing we can bet on is the sacred language of Greek. I mean, in the absence of the actual data, that's my biggest question. There are others claiming that there's drugs everywhere. I'm currently reading The Immortality Key by Brian Muraresku and find this 2nd/3rd/4th century AD time period very interesting, particularly with regards to the adoptions of pagan rituals and practices by early Christianity. And her answer was that they'd all been cleaned or treated for conservation purposes. The most colorful theory of psychedelics in religion portrays the original Santa Claus as a shaman. Where are the drugs? If you look at Dioscorides, for example, his Materia Medica, that's written in the first century AD around the same time that the Gospels themselves are being written. So I think it's really interesting details here worth following up on. That is about the future rather than the ancient history. So I point to that evidence as illustrative of the possibility that the Christians could, in fact, have gotten their hands on an actual wine. By which I mean that the Gospel of John suggests that at the very least, the evangelist hoped to market Christianity to a pagan audience by suggesting that Jesus was somehow equivalent to Dionysus, and that the Eucharist, his sacrament of wine, was equivalent to Dionysus's wine. And to be quite honest, I'd never studied the ancient Greeks in Spain. OK, now, Brian, you've probably dealt with questions like this. This time around, we have a very special edition featuring Dr. Mark Plotkin and Brian C . And when you speak in that way, what I hear you saying is there is something going on. I think it's important you have made a distinction between what was Jesus doing at the Last Supper, as if we could ever find out. So why refrain? It's not to say that there isn't evidence from Alexandria or Antioch. If your history is even remotely correct, that would have ushered in a very different church, if Valentinus's own student Marcus and the Marcosians were involved in psychedelic rituals, then that was an early road not taken, let's say. Brian C. Muraresku - Priory Of Sion BRIAN MURARESKU: I wish I could answer that question. Because very briefly, I think Brian and others have made a very strong case that these things-- this was a biotechnology that was available in the ancient world. And there were gaps as well. He draws on the theory of "pagan continuity," which holds that early Christianity adopted . So, you know, I specifically wanted to avoid heavily relying on the 52 books of the [INAUDIBLE] corpus or heavily relying too much on the Gospel of Mary Magdalene and the evidence that's come from Egypt. Love potions, love charms, they're very common in the ancient. What's the wine? And I offer psychedelics as one of those archaic techniques of ecstasy that seems to have been relevant and meaningful to our ancestors. And so in some of these psychedelic trials, under the right conditions, I do see genuine religious experiences. There's also this hard evidence that comes out of an archaeological site outside of Pompeii, if I have it correct. You take a board corporate finance attorney, you add in lots of childhood hours watching Indiana Jones, lots of law school hours reading Dan Brown, you put it all together and out pops The Immortality Key. I don't think we have found it. But what I hear from people, including atheists, like Dina Bazer, who participated in these Hopkins NYU trials is that she felt like on her one and only dose of psilocybin that she was bathed in God's love. But you will be consoled to know that someone else will be-- I will be there, but someone else will be leading that conversation. #646: Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin The Eleusinian And considering the common background of modern religions (the Pagan Continuity hypothesis), any religious group who thinks they are chosen or correct are promoting a simplistic and ignorant view of our past. CHARLES STANG: OK, great. Mark and Brian cover the Eleusinian Mysteries, the pagan continuity hypothesis, early Christianity, lessons from famed religious scholar Karen Armstrong, overlooked aspects of influential philosopher William James's career, ancient wine and ancient beer, experiencing the divine within us, the importance of "tikkun olam"repairing and . And she talks about kind of being born again, another promise from John's gospel. But please do know that we will forward all these questions to Brian so he will know the sorts of questions his work prompts. To this day I remain a psychedelic virgin quite proudly, and I spent the past 12 years, ever since that moment in 2007, researching what Houston Smith, perhaps one of the most influential religious historians of the 20th century, would call the best kept secret in history. And they found this site, along with others around the Mediterranean. There is evidence that has been either overlooked or perhaps intentionally suppressed. So thank you, all who have hung with us. Tim Ferriss Show Podcast Notes CHARLES STANG: All right. If the Dionysian one is psychedelic, does it really make its way into some kind of psychedelic Christianity? Just imagine, I have to live with me. So those are all possibly different questions to ask and answer. Nage ?] Its proponents maintain that the affable, plump old fellow associated with Christmas derives from the character of Arctic medical practitioners. But I do want to push back a little bit on the elevation of this particular real estate in southern Italy. The Continuity Hypothesis of Dreams: A More Balanced Account The Tim Ferriss Show. And this is what I present to the world. He co-writes that with Gordon Wasson and Albert Hofmann, who famously-- there it is, the three authors. Again, if you're attracted to psychedelics, it's kind of an extreme thing, right? We look forward to hosting Chacruna's founder and executive director, Bia Labate, for a lecture on Monday, March 8. It's funny to see that some of the first basilicas outside Rome are popping up here, and in and around Pompeii. What, if any, was the relationship between this Greek sanctuary-- a very Greek sanctuary, by the way-- in Catalonia, to the mysteries of Eleusis? So why do you think psychedelics are so significant that they might usher in a new Reformation? I'm sure he knows this well, by this point. And apparently, the book is on order, so I can't speak to this directly, but the ancient Greek text that preserves this liturgy also preserves the formula, the ingredients of the eye ointment. Psychedelics Weekly - Prince Harry and Psychedelics, Proposed And another: in defending the pagan continuity hypothesis, Muraresku presumes a somewhat non-Jewish, pagan-like Jesus, while ignoring the growing body of psychedelic literature, including works by . BRIAN MURARESKU: OK. He comes to this research with a full suite of scholarly skills, including a deep knowledge of Greek and Latin as well as facility in a number of European languages, which became crucial for uncovering some rather obscure research in Catalan, and also for sweet-talking the gatekeepers of archives and archaeological sites. And we had a great chat, a very spirited chat about the mysteries and the psychedelic hypothesis. I'm going to stop asking my questions, although I have a million more, as you well know, and instead try to ventriloquist the questions that are coming through at quite a clip through the Q&A. A rebirth into a new conception of the self, the self's relationship to things that are hard to define, like God. And maybe in these near-death experiences we begin to actually experience that at a visceral level. Not just in Italy, but as kind of the headquarters for the Mediterranean. What was discovered, as far as I can tell, from your treatment of it, is essentially an ancient pharmacy in this house. And Brian, it would be helpful for me to know whether you are more interested in questions that take up the ancient world or more that deal with this last issue, the sort of contemporary and the future. Continuity Questions - 36 Questions About Continuity - QuestionDB The Tim Ferriss Show Transcripts: Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, Lessons from Scholar Karen Armstrong, and Much More (#646) - The Blog of Author Tim Ferriss 3 Annual "Best of" Apple Podcasts 900+ Million episodes downloaded The Tim Ferriss Show - #535: General Stanley McChrystal Mast And we know the mysteries were there. Mona Sobhani, PhD (@monasobhaniphd) / Twitter And I think that we would behoove ourselves to incorporate, resuscitate, maybe, some of those techniques that seem to have been employed by the Greeks at Eleusis or by the Dionysians or some of these earliest Christians. He was wronged by individuals, allegedly. The answer seems to be connected to psychedelic drugs. Certainly these early churchmen used whatever they could against the forms of Christian practice they disapproved of, especially those they categorized as Gnostic. What's different about the Dionysian mysteries, and what evidence, direct or indirect, do we have about the wine of Dionysus being psychedelic? BRIAN MURARESKU: It just happens to show up. I mean, I asked lots of big questions in the book, and I fully acknowledge that. And she happened to find it on psilocybin. Because they talk about everything else that they take issue with. The altar had been sitting in a museum in Israel since the 1960s and just hadn't been tested. CHARLES STANG: Right. I appreciate this. And I want to say to those who are still assembled here that I'm terribly sorry that we can't get to all your questions. 40:15 Witches, drugs, and the Catholic Church . Thank you, sir. Did the ancient Greeks use drugs to find God? So I really follow the scholarship of Enriqueta Pons, who is the archaeologist on site there, at this Greek sanctuary that we're talking about in Catalonia, Mas Castellar des Pontos. Then I see the mysteries of Dionysus as kind of the Burning Man or the Woodstock of the ancient world. So it is already happening. 474, ?] But it was just a process of putting these pieces together that I eventually found this data from the site Mas Castellar des Pontos in Spain. He decides to get people even more drunk. And I think we're getting there. BRIAN MURARESKU: I'm bringing more illumination. 101. So Gobekli Tepe, for those who don't know, is this site in southern Turkey on the border with Syria. And that's all I present it as, is wonderfully attractive and maybe even sexy circumstantial evidence for the potential use of a psychedelic sacrament amongst the earliest Christians. And how do we-- when the pharmaceutical industry and when these retreat centers begin to open and begin to proliferate, how do we make this sacred? CHARLES STANG: OK. Now let's move into the Greek mystery. Get personalized recommendations, and learn where to watch across hundreds of streaming providers. I'd never thought before about how Christianity developed as an organized religion in the centuries after Jesus' murder. These mysteries had at their center a sacrament called kykeon, which offered a vision of the mysteries of life and death. Brought to you by Please materialize. Let me just pull up my notes here. Not because it's not there, because it hasn't been tested. It still leaves an even bigger if, Dr. Stang, is which one is psychedelic? That was the question for me. What was the wine in the early Eucharist? So the big question is, what kind of drug was this, if it was a drug? Again, it's proof of concept for going back to Eleusis and going back to other sites around the Mediterranean and continuing to test, whether for ergotized beer or other things. . Mark and Brian cover the Eleusinian Mysteries, the pagan continuity hypothesis, early Christianity, lessons from famed religious scholar Karen Armstrong, overlooked aspects of influential philosopher William James's career, ancient wine and ancient beer, experiencing the divine within us, the importance of "tikkun olam"repairing and . There's some suggestive language in the pyramid texts, in the Book of the Dead and things of this nature. And he found some beer and wine-- that was a bit surprising. Thank you. The book proposes a history of religious ritualistic psychedelic use at least as old as the ancient Greek mystery religions, especially those starting in Eleusis and dating to roughly 2,000 BC. Books about pagan continuity hypothesis? : r/AskHistorians - reddit BRIAN MURARESKU: That's a good question. So what I think we have here in this ergtotized beer drink from Catalonia, Spain, and in this weird witch's brew from 79 AD in Pompeii, I describe it, until I see evidence otherwise, as some of the very first heart scientific data for the actual existence of actual spiked wine in classical antiquity, which I think is a really big point. According to Muraresku, this work, which "presents the pagan continuity hypothesis with a psychedelic twist," addresses two fundamental questions: "Before the rise of Christianity, did the Ancient Greeks consume a secret psychedelic sacrament during their most famous and well-attended religious rituals? I'll invite him to think about the future of religion in light of all this. So what have you learned about the Eleusinian mysteries in particular since Ruck took this up, and what has convinced you that Ruck's hypothesis holds water? General Stanley McChrystal Mastering Risk: A User's Guide | Brought to you by Kettle & Fire high quality, tasty, and conveniently packaged bone broths; Eight Sleep. Now I want to get to the questions, but one last question before we move to the discussion portion. Continuity theory - Wikipedia Because ergot is just very common. Nazanin Boniadi So I'm trying to build the case-- and for some reason in my research, it kept coming back to Italy and Rome, which is why I focus on Hippolytus. I can't imagine that there were no Christians that availed themselves of this biotechnology, and I can't imagine-- it's entirely plausible to me that they would mix this biotechnology with the Eucharist. Tim Ferriss Show #646: Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin: The Eleusinian Mysteries, Discovering the Divine, The Immortality Key, The Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, Psychedelics, and More. But I don't understand how that provides any significant link to paleo-Christian practice. You mentioned, too, early churchmen, experts in heresies by the name of Irenaeus of Lyons and Hippolytus of Rome. I'm paraphrasing this one. And then at some point they go inland. PDF The continuity between pagan and Christian cult - Scandinavia When Irenaeus is talking about [SPEAKING GREEK], love potions, again, we have no idea what the hell he's talking about. I really tried. And I answer it differently every single time. Like, what is this all about? But they charge Marcus specifically, not with a psychedelic Eucharist, but the use of a love potion. The Religion has a Name: "Shamanism" - AKJournals Administration and supervision endeavors and with strong knowledge in: Online teaching and learning methods, Methods for Teaching Mathematics and Technology Integration for K-12 and College . So to find dog sacrifice inside this Greek sanctuary alludes to this proto-witch, Hecate, the mother of Circe, who is mentioned in the same hymn to Demeter from the 8th, 7th century BC, as kind of the third of the goddesses to whom these mysteries were dedicated. So listening right now, there's at least one orthodox priest, there's at least one Catholic priest, an Episcopalian, an Anglican, and several others with whom I've been talking in recent months. Others find it in different ways, but the common denominator seems to be one of these really well-curated near-death experiences. After the first few chapters the author bogs down flogging the Pagan Continuity Hypothesis and exulting over his discovery of small scraps of evidence he found in a decade of research. A profound knowledge of visionary plants, herbs, and fungi passed from one generation to the next, ever since the Stone Age? Brian C. Muraresku with Dr. Mark Plotkin The Eleusinian Mysteries Brian's thesis, that of the Pagan Continuity Hypothesis, was explored by Alexander Hislop in his "The Two Babylons", 1853, as a Protestant treatise in the spirit of Martin Luther as Alexander too interjects the Elusinian Mysteries. But let me say at the outset that it is remarkably learned, full of great historical and philological detail. Pagan Continuity and Christian Attitudes: When did Paganism End? That's one narrative that I feel is a little sensational. CHARLES STANG: Brian, I want to thank you for your time. And what it has to do with Eleusis or the Greek presence in general, I mean, again, just to say it briefly, is that this was a farmhouse of sorts that was inland, this sanctuary site. To sum up the most exciting parts of the book: the bloody wine of Dionysius became the bloody wine of Jesus - the pagan continuity hypothesis - the link between the Ancient Greeks of the final centuries BC and the paleo-Christians of the early centuries AD - in short, the default psychedelic of universal world history - the cult of . Mark and Brian cover the Eleusinian Mysteries, the pagan continuity hypothesis, early Christianity, lessons from famed religious scholar Karen Armstrong, overlooked aspects of influential philosopher William James's career, ancient wine and ancient beer, experiencing the divine within us, the importance of " tikkun olam "repairing and improving Now are there any other questions you wish to propose or push or-- I don't know, to push back against any of the criticisms or questions I've leveled? But it's not an ingested psychedelic. There were formula. But what I see are potential and possibilities and things worthy of discussions like this. Brian C. Muraresku (@BrianMuraresku) / Twitter I was not going to put a book out there that was sensationalist. And I wonder whether the former narrative serves the interests of the latter. With more than 35 years of experience in the field of Education dedicated to help students, teachers and administrators in both public and private institutions at school, undergraduate and graduate level. So I have my concerns about what's about to happen in Oregon and the regulation of psilocybin for therapeutic purposes. In this way, the two traditions coexisted in a syncretic form for some time before . That's all just fancy wordplay. Samuel Zuschlag - Durham University - Charlotte, North - LinkedIn Richard Evans Schultes and the Search for Ayahuasca 17 days ago Plants of the Gods: S3E10. When you start testing, you find things. Which turns out, it may be they were. This time, tonight I'll say that it's just not my time yet. This two-part discussion between Muraresku and Dr. Plotkin examines the role psychedelics have played in the development of Western civilization. The continuity hypothesis of dreams suggests that the content of dreams are largely continuous with waking concepts and concerns of the dreamer. And I don't know what that looks like. I'm skeptical, Dr. Stang. CHARLES STANG: I have one more question about the pre-Christian story, and that has to do with that the other mystery religion you give such attention to. This limestone altar tested positive for cannabis and frankincense that was being burned, they think, in a very ritualistic way. Amongst all the mystery religions, Eleusis survives. There was an absence of continuity in the direction of the colony as Newport made his frequent voyages to and . Now, I don't put too much weight into that. CHARLES STANG: OK. And that's a question equally for ancient historians and for contemporary seekers and/or good Catholics. Liked by Samuel Zuschlag. CHARLES STANG: So it may be worth mentioning, for those who are attending who haven't read the book, that you asked, who I can't remember her name, the woman who is in charge of the Eleusis site, whether some of the ritual vessels could be tested, only to discover-- tested for the remains of whatever they held, only to learn that those vessels had been cleaned and that no more vessels were going to be unearthed. I'm happy to be proven wrong. Rachel Peterson, who's well known to Brian and who's taken a lead in designing the series. Did the Early Church Use Psychedelics? - Substack It's only in John that Jesus is described as being born in the lap of the Father, the [SPEAKING GREEK] in 1:18, very similar to the way that Dionysus sprung miraculously from the thigh of Zeus, and on and on and on-- which I'm not going to bore you and the audience.
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